"They want to deliver Petrobras and the Amazon" | Speak …

Amid the huge demonstrations against Jair Bolsonaro so as not to destroy education, Lula 's most trustworthy man went through Argentina and explained the entire office: the president of Brazil speaks to him at 20 or 25%, but the rest He began to worry about health, education and the economy. According to Luiz Dulci, the novelty is that they have changed the subjects of the public agenda.

Dulci was General Secretary of the Presidency during the eight years of the government of Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva, from the first day of 2003 until the last day of 2010. He then accompanied the daily activities of the leader of the Workers Party of the Lula Institute until the prison of the founder of the PT, whose grouping is vice president this professor of literature who led the biggest unemployed teacher of Brazilian history. He deployed contacts in Argentina at the invitation of the Federation of Workers of Industry, Services and Allies (FeTIA, led by Pedro Wasiejko) with the support of the Front Grande.

– The problem in Brazil does not seem to be the adjustment. But there is a deep crisis.

-Adaptation was carried out by Michel Temer after the coup, with the support of the establishment and the major media. The industry was starting to suffer a great depression. For fear, they kept him in power until the elections simply because he was weak. And, being weak, they could force him to conform to the difficult schedule. Then came Bolsonaro and his rough countryside.

-Why crude?

-It is not a subjective appreciation of me. MPs who share the camera with him for many years say that he's interested in three or four things, especially important ones.

– But the economy seems stagnant today.

Paulo Guedes, the finance minister, predicted that Brazil would grow by 5% this year. That will not happen Ni Guedes will not approve the pension reform in the tough terms he proposed. At the same time, rural workers, the poor and women suffer heavy losses. During these months, expectations fell to zero growth. Public investment fell. Housing policy has been cut. Infrastructure works, such as airports and roads, as well as logistics, have been interrupted or suspended. The consumption of families has decreased. The government wants to move everything forward. In his policy of bias and in the delivery of Petrobras, electric power and the Amazon. The government hoped that with the victory of Bolsonaro the announcement of an ultra-liberal program would bring in foreign investment. I do not pbad. Some entrepreneurs bought badets at very low prices. But there was no new investment. There are a lot of similarities with the failure of ultra-liberal politics in Argentina.

-Major graphic media and Globo sometimes criticize Bolsonaro.

-A party does it. But only the style. Or children. No to the economic program. Today, even the former ministers of Fernando Henrique Cardoso, who was a long-time but long-time man, argue that the obsession with a new social security law undermines growth opportunities. Unemployment has reached a frightening figure: 14 million. We are already talking about a recession. Three consecutive quarters constitute a technical recession.

Others talk more moderately about stagnation.

– Do they speak in public?

– Yes, although in the case of PT, the word "publicly" does not apply to the most watched programs on television. They also do not invite Fernando Haddad, our candidate in 2018 and who has received 47 million votes. But the discussion is filtered every time in society. And it develops. Liberal economists like Andrés Lara Rezende, one of the fathers of Real Plan Franco Itamar and his minister Cardoso, a man very critical of the PT but endowed with a civilizing sensibility , wrote that it was a suicidal strategy. But the sacrifice of the poor can not be a solution. Even Fernando Henrique is worried about the situation. Inflation increases even in the midst of a crisis in the sector. There is a reduction in wages in real terms. We can already talk about the failure of ultra-liberal economic policy.

– Bolsonaro is as popular as when he won?

-Not at all. His image has fallen, especially in the poor and popular sectors. It does not react with economic measures but with fights that it qualifies as ideological and which, in reality, are falsely moral. He attacks homobaduals, badual liberties, communism, universities and educators, who he described as "useful idiots" and "maneuvering mbades". Parliamentarians are increasingly questioning Bolsonaro. He says it's because of the "old policy" that would prevent renewal. But he has been a member of Parliament for more than 20 years and has gone through many parties.

– What's going on with the PT?

-We are participating in the growing resistance to the predatory retirement proposal, to privatizations, to the policy of transferring oil deposits to great depths of pre-salt. And we are about to present a proposal for economic measures. Pension reform poses very difficult problems for women, who will lose even more rights than men. In general, if pension reform is approved, the government might be tempted to emulate Margaret Thatcher in 1979 and clean up all parts of the state: electricity, financial system, petroleum, petrochemicals , banks … This would be very serious because For example, public banks in our time have gone from 25 to 40% of the market and have prevented the country from going into recession.

– Does the company listen to the PT?

Yes Many are also starting to ask us to introduce alternatives. Haddad himself works with the party's president, Gleisi Hoffmann, at the head of a team that presents proposals, as a social pact to get out of the economic crisis. These problems weigh more every day. Bolsonaro took office on January 1 and from then on, we only had to discuss issues such as violation of sovereignty and authoritarianism. Now the socio-economic dimension is added. Our members work very well with those of the Socialist Party and Freedom, with those of the Communist Party of Brazil and with other forces. Together, we are 120 MPs out of 530. We make ourselves heard in Congress.

– What does Lula do in prison?

-It is very knowledgeable, very in tune with the strategy. He insists that the center of our politics should be what affects the life of the majority: retirement, education and health. And he is right, because with his prejudices about naked bolononon, he is speaking today with only 25% of his constituents.

– How are these 25%?

– These are sectors that react against the secularization of social life. It is not just a matter of pastors, as they say sometimes, but the fruit of people who have been raised with an archaic view of the family. That's why they face us. The PT was still open. Pioneer in the feminist question, in the question of blacks. These backward sectors, on the other hand, go so far as to say that the public school is a nest of snakes and encourage home education. There is a movement called school without party. They do not present Paulo Freire as the example of a great educator, but as the symbol of a so-called "cultural Marxism". There was a conflict between social values ​​and security values. Not only in terms of public safety. Bolsonaro promoted strong and violent leadership. And the effects are felt. A group of soldiers fired 80 shots at a family in their car.

-In the meantime, waves of protest against public education are multiplying.

-It was that there was an attack on education. A linear reduction of 30% in all universities. A scholarship cut as much as diplomas and rectorado. Vahán Agopyian, rector of the University of São Paulo, very prestigious, said that the USP would thus lose the federal system of scholarships. Without arguing with name and first name, he refuted all the accusations of Bolsonaro. The rector is an engineer but he refuted the attacks of Bolsonaro against the humanist zones. Surveys show that today the population is proud of the arrival of their children at the university. The Catholic Church is very moderate in Brazil. But he 's echoed the social humor and also criticized the pension reform and the cuts in education.

-And Sergio Moro, the judge who sentenced Lula and was appointed Minister of Justice of Bolsonaro? Is it still important?

-The legal world criticizes it more and more. A movement has emerged, Rights Now.

– Sounds to Direct Now, the great movement of 1984 by direct vote, without voters in between.

-C is like that. Many sectors listen to us because the comparison with the years of Lula and Dilma is in progress. There are bigger and bigger meetings. The last six ministers of the environment met and published a manifesto. Including Marina Silva, who competed against the PT. They were very tough because they said that Bolsonaro was putting an end to all the protective structures. The same thing was done in foreign policy by retired ambbadadors and former ministers, such as Rubens Ricupero and Roberto Abdenur, who questioned the developments in the Middle East and the Middle East. automatic alignment on the United States. This is not just the left who reacts. A new critic appears every week. Actors, actresses, rockers …

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