Felipe González: "We are at the end of the Chavismo cycle" – 05/04/2019

How is this crisis observed in the region at the origin of the Venezuelan debacle??

– What surprises me most about Venezuela in Latin America, is that there is still a part of the left capable of supporting an unconditional tyranny like that represented by Nicolás Maduro. A kleptocracy linked to the worst and dirtiest businesses. Maduro achieved something that seemed impossible, destroying a country like Venezuela in such a short time, but he did, he destroyed it institutionally, he destroyed security. The deaths in Caracas represent the same percentage as during the worst period of Damascus in the middle of the war in Syria. That's what strikes us all

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– Hugo Chávez is not involved in this drift?

– Hugo Chávez creates a model that is not sustainable. But Chávez had some differences with Maduro: First personality. Chavez was a military leader and the military recognized him as a leader, including Jair Bolsonaro in 2005/2006. In addition, Chávez had the instinct of conservation against the precipice. Not mature, he continues to destroy. It is an "exploit" that weighs 60% of GDP, with the highest number of deaths per capita in the world, causing a biblical exodus of Venezuelans.

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– How are you doing?

– When you tell me simplistically in Europe, you must go immediately to the elections … There is no census, no national electoral council, no supreme court. Well, there is … under Maduro's orders. At least there must be a census and an electoral council to guarantee the elections.

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Venezuela is also a zone of conflict between the world powers.

Venezuela is a regional crisis that has rocked Latin America like never before. As for Russia, Putin will not play for Venezuela, it is obvious. Cuba has no choice. For Cuba, it is a problem of survival. But for Moscow, it's about seeing how it exchanges some of the issues that Putin is most concerned about with Trump, who gives him all the space he needs to pretend to be a superpower in Syria.

-What is happening with China?

– For starters, there is no strict debt to be charged to Venezuela. China has a lease of oil paid with crude oil, as is the case with Ukraine for cereals. The Chinese must have 42 or 43 billion (in dollars) to recover 60 billion origin. This commitment with Venezuela is not comparable to the more than 200 billion it has committed in the region. The Chinese are really patient, they see the long term and they will not play for Venezuela. Now, I want to say something, it will not be acceptable for me to repeat, as was the case with Stalin or Hitler, that there are people who say "man, we do not know". Because obviously Maduro will leave, and when he goes out, all the horror will surface. Who today does not know what is happening in Venezuela, it is because he does not want to know.

-The current situation is very worrying with military domination.

– Bayonets support Maduro

– Is this a non-permanent situation?

-I think we are at the end of this cycle. Since I do not have West Indian character, I do not anticipate either D-day or H-time, a custom of my friends. I spoke with Leopoldo (López). I will also talk with Juan (Guaidó). I know what's going on. I think we are at the end. Without being too specific, I affirm that the conversations (with the generals) existed and that there was a lot of disappointment. I see Cuban intelligence installing traps. But two years ago, these contacts did not exist. So something rushes,

-What is supposed to happen?

– In Venezuela, a coup d'etat is not necessary, it is enough that the army of the four forces agrees to tell Maduro that we have arrived. We remove the bayonets and you have no floor. This is a necessary but not sufficient condition. I think that it would be necessary to negotiate if it is possible, otherwise it will be the exit of Maduro and his group. And form a transitional government for two months, which must be inclusive. In addition, there is a need for the military to restore some degree of security, as some states are overrun with crime. And have a figure that is not yet clear, able to give credibility to Venezuela's economic rescue.

Trump and Putin spoke Friday of Venezuela and the two foreign ministers meet this week. Is Russia the key?

– The action of Russia on the regime is infinitely lower than that of Cuba. Who else knows what is happening in Venezuela, it is the intelligence of Cuba. Colombia, which has a million and a maximum number of refugees, is another country that has no choice but to know. With a similar number in Europe, the entire EU has 500 million inhabitants and 30,000 USD per inhabitant. He also knows a lot about Brazilian military intelligence. And he knows much less And what he knows does not work rationally because it is impossible to function rationally with a president like Trump. On January 5, 2018, when he took over Maduro, United States. He had no decision to make regarding Venezuela, so it was Trump's willingness to offer an international political triumph with Maduro's head.