The debts are paid, we all agree on that, but the scams do not do it

Political leader, former national deputy, CTA economist, student of the Argentine foreign debt, Claudio Lozano has a long history in the field of the center-left, close to the national thought, without however integrating the PJ. During the previous stages, he participated in several frentist experiences of progressivism, always distancing himself from kirchnerism. Until the arrival of the Front of all, he seduced him and decided to integrate his political force, the Popular Unity.

In exclusivity with LaCapital, he celebrated the candidacy of Alberto Fernández, "which expands the space of Kirchnerism", while asking to open a debate on the country left by Macri: "The debts are paid, not scams ".

– There were other political fronts with kirchnerist Peronism as the axis (such as the FpV) to which the sectors of the national left and progressivist did not integrate. Why now decided to join the Front of all, where a very wide arc and the whole of the Peronism participates?

– Because of the depth of the crisis and the need to get rid of the force defeated by the policies imposed by the Fund. Macri, on the other hand, expresses much more than an adjustment, puts a lot of things at risk, subordinates us to the United States. The FdT is composed of 16 political parties (among which the Popular Unity, the Lozano party); we would have preferred that the forehead be formed before and not be subordinated to the definition of the formula. The opportunity to manage it is now, with an institutional table that has not yet been created. Fronts integrated by forces of very different sizes, as in this case, usually have a voice that prevails over others … We must allow debate and then find a voice that synthesizes everything. An example could be the Frente Amplio of Uruguay.

-The morning of Saturday, May 18, when Cristina Kirchner anointed Alberto Fernández, you were one of the first to celebrate, why?

"Because he's expanded the space." Cristina's electoral strategy has been really good.

The Macri government has increased Argentina's external debt exponentially in just three-and-a-half years. Was it legal, can it or should it be revised?

"The debt has been contracted by a legally constituted government, but that does not make the debt legal or not. What needs to be established is whether the officials who contracted the debt complied with the procedures and regulations in force. For example, if the 100-year bond loan contracted by Nicolas Caputo is used, it was not provided for in the budget, did not bid with the banks, did not comply with the legal provisions and also increased Caputo's own funds, because it constituted a fund. investment related to him. There I see no legality. Can we afford it? Anyway, one of the problems is the illegitimacy of the indebtedness of the military dictatorship and the other, in the case of a legal government like that of Macri, is the procedure provided for by law and which has not been respected. The same is true of the debt to the IMF, which did not go through Congress when it was supposed to happen.

– From the national government, they say they have the legal right to take on debt …

-It is not true. The article of the law on financial administration that empowers the executive to incur debts with multilateral organizations is not in force. It was abandoned by the 1994 Constitution and only applies when it is extended and has not been extended. The law on financial management is in force, but the article that delegates the possibility of negotiating with the IMF without deadlines or objectives. The IMF also did not respect its statutes by lending to Argentina, which can not lend for a leak. Of the $ 106 billion that Macri borrowed, 70,000 escaped, a completely irrational situation. The debts are paid, we all agree on that. But scams are not paid. The next government must convene a bicameral commission in Parliament to verify the public debt.

– If the debt is under investigation, it is possible that an immediate campaign from the political and financial sectors indicates that the FdT will not pay the debt.

– On the contrary, I am not talking about repudiation of the debt, we say that the Parliament has the obligation to check if the legal mechanisms have been respected. It is not that the FdT wants to evade the law, but rather that it respects the law in force. Argentina's legal framework takes into account the repayment capacity, the debt can not be taken well above repayment capacity and produces economic, social and political damages in the short or medium term. Argentine law does not allow it.

"How do you rate debt conditioning for the new government?

-Macri takes credit from the IMF with the sole objective of obtaining political support for re-election and unsustainably conditions the new government. If the expirations are not delayed, there is no oxygen. And the IMF's most serious problem is its political conditioning, such as regressive labor reforms, social security, and so on.

– Your position on the debt is not identical to that of other FdT economists. Would a debate within the FdT on debt be desirable and productive?

– Different positions, there are some. I think it would be nice if we debated the profit of the whole. Here is a citizenship that was expressed during the election. There has been a beating that does not just tell us that Macri has to leave, he also indicates that the policies to be applied must be different. At present, some sectors of the economic and financial world will try directly to enforce the adjustment by the new government because change has failed. A liberal economist like Guillermo Calvo said it directly. As Macri could not, that adjustment be applied by "populism". It would go against the vote of the people.

– How do you imagine the development of political tensions in the event that the FdT applies a reverse economic program to the current program?

"Macri's electoral catastrophe is linked to very solid data, such as the drop of 2.5 million middle-clbad people to vulnerability or directly to poverty. This happened in only three and a half years. Today, 58% of Argentines are endangered or vulnerable. If you are not going to recompose the income of the population, forget the maintenance of political legitimacy.

– And how does the income of the population recompose?

-With the regulation of capital movements and foreign exchange earnings of exporters and the supervision of the financial system. The exchange rate can not be managed without even knowing what money it is, or let it filter as it has been the case in recent years. "Markets" must have a broad political consensus and a willingness to do different things.

– Can governance be left in check by the action of the "markets"?

– You must leave the trap of the discourse on "governance"; that is why they tell Alberto Fernández "to talk to the markets", to try to condition it. Alberto Fernández does not have to get into that. The one who must guarantee the transition is the Macri government, and if it can not send a law to Congress to advance the elections and change of command.

– In Kirchnerism, there were regulations on capital movements, how do you evaluate them?

– Kirchnerism practiced "actions" when everything had already escaped. And he has not kept control of the offer of dollars. However, he applied delays to the liquidators to liquidate, unlike today.