"Hooligans have been a forerunner of Pegida" | TIME ONLINE

Michael Gabriel, 54, runs the National Coordination Center for Fan Projects (Kos) since 2006, this Wednesday in Berlin. celebrates 25 years with a congress

TIME ONLINE: Mr Gabriel, congratulations. What was this era in 1993 when it was founded?

Michael Gabriel: It was the time soon after the great football disasters. At Heysel in 1985, 39 fans were killed after riots. In Hillsborough, 96 spectators died of panic in 1989. For almost all German internationals came a lot, sometimes over a thousand hooligansIn addition, shortly after reunification, state structures in East Germany were very fragile. In November 1990, Mike Polley, a fan of CFB Dynamo Berlin, died as a result of police action in Leipzig. In 1991, the European Cup match between Dynamo Dresden and Red Star Belgrade was canceled as a result of riots. German football was under enormous pressure. Even a five-year ban, as in England, seemed possible.

TIME ONLINE: The clbadic German answer would have been the hard hand.

GabrielHowever, from other contexts and from science, we have recently learned of the limits of the repressive treatment of such problems. And with the projects of socio-educational supporters, among others in Bremen, Frankfurt or Hanover, we had a very good experience. The time had come for a national coordinating office to set up a national network. At that time, there were twelve fan projects, there are now 59.

TIME ONLINEIn the 1980s, football was characterized by racism and right-wing extremism, monkey lutes and banana throwing. What is your memory

GabrielIn the ranks, there was a clear domination of ideologies on the right. Partial fan groups have maintained links with the neo-Nazi scene. Many were violent. In addition, visitors to the Bundesliga stadia were twice as likely as today, even fewer women. Representatives of an open fan culture were in the minority and were not taken seriously. It is our greatest achievement to have supported these people permanently.

TIME ONLINE: How is it in the curves today?

Gabriel: Vice versa. Of course, there are still conflicts today. In Aachen, Dortmund, Duisburg or Braunschweig, far-right groups opposed cosmopolitan groups. But the opposing forces are in the majority today. On the racist songs, we reacted directly in almost all stages of German professional football.

TIME ONLINE: What were the milestones of this quarter century?

Gabriel: There were. True, the founding of Baff 1993, the alliance of antifascist and now active football supporters who fight against discrimination and racism. FC St. Pauli has great merit because he applies his principles in the football world. Theo Zwanziger has done a very valuable job as chair of the DFB against homophobia and anti-Semitism. But above all, the projects of supporters and the supporters themselves have always animated the process, for example if there was no one in the clubs who was open to their subjects. Dynamo Dresden for example, it was a long time ago when it was about his turn. Today, the club is going a lot better.

TIME ONLINE: Associations and clubs are sometimes criticized for not being important for fans.

Gabriel: On the other hand, I want to protect her, at least against the provisional judgment. The many fan projects are just there, because in addition to the public hand promotes football. About 13 million euros of costs per year, half of which with DFB and DFL. This remarkable commitment should make the badociations more offensive. And clubs now take on social responsibility, as shown by Werder Bremen, Borussia Dortmund and Dynamo Dresden. Sensitizing them is another success of fan projects.

TIME ONLINE: What does their work look like in everyday life?

GabrielColleagues in fan projects do clbadic social work. For example, once the trust is there, they go to the matches outside and listen to the fans or help them by providing them with points of contact. It's work, family, drugs, debts, legal disputes, everything. But they also provide political education, such as trips to Auschwitz or Dachau, or create international meetings. Most importantly, they accompany CVs. I remember the 20th anniversary of the Leverkusen fan project. Three fans of three generations gave speeches. Everyone said that he did not know where he would be today without the fan project manager. It was touching. I would like politicians to hear this more often.